While I'm sitting with Ray Winstone in the almost-deserted bar of the Clarence Hotel on a Wednesday afternoon, a Scottish drunk weaves his way past all the empty tables and plonks himself and his two pints of lager down beside us. It's barely five o' clock, but our new friend has already passed the point of no return - it's impossible to understand a word he's saying. Winstone amiably raises his eyes to heaven, but politely rebuffs the unintelligible verbal assault. His expression hardens, though, when the drunk starts aggressively mimicking his Cockney accent. Out of the corner of my eye, I can see the PR woman starting to flutter nervously . . . Fortunately, a brace of barmen materialise on either side of the interloper and politely but firmly persuade him to take a hike.
"F...ing dodgy Scotsmen - I've had 'em all my life", says Winstone, settling back in his chair and chuckling. "I've had so many fights with them, and it's always early in the evening. And there's only one way to deal with them, know what I mean? Only thing to do is f...ing give them a clout early on, because they're going to drive you mad all night."
If you don't know already, you may have gathered from this outburst that Ray Winstone is not the kind of actor who goes in for air-kissing or calling people "darling". In 20-odd years, his performances in such groundbreaking British movies as Quadrophenia and Scum, his hard-man roles in television series like Between the Lines and last year's Births, Marriages and Deaths, and his brilliant portrayal of a wife-beating petty criminal in Gary Oldman's memorable directorial debut, Nil by Mouth, have cemented his public image as the quintessential hard man. He may be sporting a blonde feather cut (for continuity purposes on a film he's currently shooting in Spain) rather than the close-cropped Number One he normally favours, but the sportswear and trainers adorning his chunky frame are classic dodgygeezer clobber.
With a public image like that, I suggest, he must sometimes get trouble from people who recognise him. "Well, they're the parts I love doing. If it's good I go and do it. Anyway, I don't think ahead about what kind of thing I should be doing next. Just whatever's good, and pays the rent. But I've got to tell you, in 20-odd years, I've only had that kind of trouble twice. People are usually really civil. They'll say they saw you in something the other night; it was good or they didn't like it, and that's it. Anyway, I always drink with mates in the same places, where everyone knows me."
In The War Zone, Tim Roth's bleak, disturbing portrayal of the effect of incest and child abuse on a family in 1970s Devon, Winstone plays the seemingly affectionate father who is secretly raping his teenaged daughter (Lara Belmont). "I just wanted to work with Tim, and I liked the script", he says. "The subject matter was irrelevant in a way; it's all about how you're going to go about it. The thing with this was, how was I going to approach it? How do you talk to someone about it? I didn't want to talk to a kid who'd been abused about what happened to them. I'm just making a film - they don't know me. And I certainly don't want to talk to the guy who's abused a kid, because I'd want to kill him, basically.
"So, I found little clues in different places. In Sweden I saw an information poster about child abuse. There's a picture of four guys - a bus driver, a doctor, a lawyer and a businessman - and it says: `One in four men in Sweden abuses'. So you ask yourself: which one? It might be the guy you're drinking with in the pub; it might be someone you've known all your life. I don't know. And why don't these people get caught? Because they're good liars. There's two films within one here. One is about a man and his kids, and the other is a horror story, which is one scene basically."
That one scene, in which the teenaged son (Freddie Cunliffe) observes his father raping his sister in a derelict clifftop bunker, is depressing and shocking in equal measure, and Winstone admits it overshadowed the entire film.
"At times it was a very painful experience. We had laughs during the shoot, because you have to have laughs when you're working. But in the backs of all our heads there was this thought that `Oh, God, we still have to do the bunker scene.' It was one of the worst days of my life. I was asking myself why do I want to do this. It's only a film, for f..k's sake. So we had rows, I was threatening to walk, doing all those things actors do that I hate."
Usually, if you talk to actors about the part they're playing, they will have found some way of justifying that character's actions, whether it's a Loyalist serial killer or a Nazi concentration camp officer. It's generally accepted as a necessary part of the preparation for a role that you have to find some justification or reason for your character's behaviour. Did Winstone try at all to understand the motivation of his character in The War Zone? "No, because I ain't going to look for no backstory on a paedophile or a child abuser. I've got no interest in that at all. I couldn't do it. I'd last about 30 seconds and then I'd end up being done for murder. I've got kids. Being a dad, I've got no time for that; I just think, kill them, and I don't really believe in capital punishment. That has nothing to do with the film, that's just me."
So how did he approach playing the part? "Well, I don't know. There's very few characters I've played that I don't like. I can only surmise that he's a brilliant liar. Originally, at the end of the story he says sorry, but I wasn't having that. And everyone we spoke to who has dealt with these people reckoned we got it right."
The War Zone is the latest in a lengthening line of contemporary films which deal with incest and sexual abuse, including such recent European offerings as Festen and Seul Contre Tous. Winstone agrees that it's an issue which seems to be becoming increasingly prominent in many different cultures. "I remember when I was a kid, we used to play in the streets in London. And the day that all changed and stopped was the day Hindley and Brady killed the kids on the Moors. Because that was when television and the media were becoming more of an influence. And suddenly parents weren't letting their kids play on the streets anymore. But I think we're all starting to realise that this is just the tip of the iceberg."
LIKE Gary Oldman and Tim Roth, Winstone was greatly influenced as an actor by the late TV director Alan Clarke, who in the 1980s gave all three some of their most significant roles, and whose hard-edged style can be seen in both Roth's and Oldman's directorial efforts. "They come from the same style, but it shows in very different ways", says Winstone. "Alan Clarke would have been very proud of both those boys and what they're doing. Everything I know, I got from Clarkey, and so did they. Things like not compromising at the end of a story, playing it truthfully. Clarkey had a way of getting you in the right mood for a scene by talking you into it, and so do Tim and Gary. It's not about shouting action or any of that shit. It's about directing them in a way that they hardly know they're being directed."
Clearly passionate about The War Zone, he confesses that he's been pleasantly surprised at the reaction the film has received so far at festivals around the world. "At the time, I swore I'd never make a film like that again, but I've changed my mind since. I'd do it tomorrow, know what I mean? To me, it's one of the most responsible, dignified movies I've ever seen."
The War Zone opens next Friday at the Irish Film Centre
